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birdwatcher_ed

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Reply with quote  #31 
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I'm in SE Michigan. Yep, the SES 3 PBS signal is really low ... it just started this last weekend. I normally record the 8-11pm block and the last solid recording was on 11/11. Thinking it was my setup, I tried changing the dish position but the dish was already at the peak. Every other channel I have programmed on SES 3 locks up normally. I think we should start a letter/email writing campaign. Maybe that will get their attention ...


I'm gonna miss it too.  The letters might get their attention.  Do you have a Ku dish?  You probably know there are PBS stations at 125w and 87w, right? What was on during the 8-11pm block? 

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The Wolverine State
mountaineer

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Reply with quote  #32 
PBS Seems to be back on SES 3 cband..not as strong as before but back.
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Skip

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Reply with quote  #33 
I spoke to PBS yesterday and they said their technicians will look into it.
Before I called I checked to see if it was back. No luck.

Here is their reply:
Thank you for clarifying the ways you receive PBS. I have alerted our technology team to the c-band outage you are experiencing. 

Tonight I am using AMC21.

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babadem

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Reply with quote  #34 
It's coming in here tonight at 6.2dB.
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AZBox Me, MicroHD, Octagon SF8008 and TBS6903. DG-380 Motor (43.1°W to 127.0°W), on 1.2M Geosat Pro.  3ABN Dish @30.0°W. 2nd 1.2M looking @103.0°W. 12FT Paraclipse Dish looking from 37.5°W to 111.1°W.[cool]
Ricardo's geo-orbit archive: https://web.archive.org/web/20071202191450/http://www.geo-orbit.org:80/sizepgs/tuningp2.html
Johnny_Fever

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Reply with quote  #35 
I set up an 8 foot dedicated C band dish for SES3 this week. Most of the TP's aren't visible on a blind scan. All I seem to be able to get is some shopping channels and TV Montana. Even the TP's that have scrambled channels on them with the 30000 sr don't even register with signal or quality at all. And I'm not even sure if PBS is still up. How is everyone else doing on this sat? I am well within the 41 part of the map.

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ohare

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Reply with quote  #36 
PBS sunset on CBand March 4, 2019
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Captain_Kurtz

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Reply with quote  #37 
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The only thing I could think of that might have knocked the signal down was adding the elbow to my Corotor for my Norsat C band LNB. I have read but not confirmed that the elbow will knock your signal down by about 3db


Congrats Kermit on getting your C-band dish up and running again.
I know that it's been repeated several times, but I just cannot believe that an elbow should knock 3dB off the signal.
I will have to test, but more like a fraction of a dB would be my estimate.
If you really want to improve your signal, switch out the corotor for an orthomode feedhorn. You will of course need a second LNB and a 13V/18V multiswitch.

Quote:
tells you suggested dish size. Most of Canada C band says 6.2 foot dish.


Those "suggested dish size" charts seem to be a lot of wishful thinking and grossly underestimate the size needed in the real world. For one thing, it doesn't seem like interference from other satellites is taken into account.

Quote:
Consider DVB-S2 8PSK FEC 9/10 (CBS & ABC use that). The min required is 11 dB. So it goes without saying all other factors being equal, it will be a lot harder to achieve 11 dB on a 7.5' dish than say a 10 or 12 ft dish.


With a lot of tweaking, and choosing the right LNBF, I am able to get those ABC feeds on G16 on a 5.5' mesh dish - but the dish aim has to be spot on; it goes from zero to a lock with around 12dB of S/N with just the slightest adjustment - which made them the perfect choice for aligning the feedhorn and the dish.

Quote:
I set up an 8 foot dedicated C band dish for SES3 this week. Most of the TP's aren't visible on a blind scan. All I seem to be able to get is some shopping channels and TV Montana.


Something must be off or out of alignment, because I had no trouble getting everything from 103W with an 8' (solid fiberglass) dish.
Next door at 101W is a different story - much smaller "sweet spot" to find the signal and get a lock.
Kermit

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Reply with quote  #38 
Thanks as always for your support Captain! For over just over 2 years it was heck being excluded from the hobby I dedicated my life to. I agree that an ortho feed would be the ultimate solution. I finally got an amazing local sign company to help me move the dish just as winter was setting in. And then I bought a scaffold which I always wanted for working on the bud. I had to rush to get everything working before -50 temps set in. I recently got some brand new parts so when spring rolls around I need to change the polorotor motor, get a shim in around the mount of the dish and do a more accurate alignment. As far as the elbow goes I'm going to try it without it as well and see if there is any change in signal strength. SES 3 C band is still problematic for me but everything else around it comes in fine so when the snow starts to melt I'll have to try different things to correct whatever the problem may be.
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Johnny_Fever

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Reply with quote  #39 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain_Kurtz


Congrats Kermit on getting your C-band dish up and running again.
I know that it's been repeated several times, but I just cannot believe that an elbow should knock 3dB off the signal.
I will have to test, but more like a fraction of a dB would be my estimate.
If you really want to improve your signal, switch out the corotor for an orthomode feedhorn. You will of course need a second LNB and a 13V/18V multiswitch.



Those "suggested dish size" charts seem to be a lot of wishful thinking and grossly underestimate the size needed in the real world. For one thing, it doesn't seem like interference from other satellites is taken into account.



With a lot of tweaking, and choosing the right LNBF, I am able to get those ABC feeds on G16 on a 5.5' mesh dish - but the dish aim has to be spot on; it goes from zero to a lock with around 12dB of S/N with just the slightest adjustment - which made them the perfect choice for aligning the feedhorn and the dish.



Something must be off or out of alignment, because I had no trouble getting everything from 103W with an 8' (solid fiberglass) dish.
Next door at 101W is a different story - much smaller "sweet spot" to find the signal and get a lock.
I agree, something is not quite right. There doesn't seem to be tree branches or leaves to cause a problem at this time of year. The feedhorn looks like it's centered but I'm not sure about the dish. It is aluminum and I'm not 100% positive that it is true. I'm using one of Norsat's most highly rated LNB's. The only other thing I can think of is the focal distance. I forget how to measure and set it. Everything on the Ku side of this bird is rock solid on both polarities.

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Captain_Kurtz

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Reply with quote  #40 
Here's how to determine if the dish is warped or not, and measure and calculate focal length at the same time: Pull four strings tight across the dish, so they are 45° apart and tape them in place with duct tape on the back edge of the dish. If the dish is true, then they should all meet at the center and just touch each other; if there are any gaps, then the dish is warped. The point where they meet is obviously just above the center of the dish, to help you aim your feedhorn.
Measure the exact diameter and the depth of the dish where the strings meet, then use this formula to calculate focal length:

http://www.satsig.net/focal-length-parabolic-dish.htm

Keep in mind that different feedhorns have different sweet spots - how far they want the focal point in the feedhorn.
satdish

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Reply with quote  #41 
45 deg apart how do you know its 45 deg apart? Im thinking measure strings with elevation tool?
Captain_Kurtz

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Reply with quote  #42 
Four strings evenly spaced will be 45° apart.
The exact angle isn't important. The important thing is that they all line up in the middle, so you can see if they all touch or not, and also measure the the depth of the dish.
Johnny_Fever

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Reply with quote  #43 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain_Kurtz
Here's how to determine if the dish is warped or not, and measure and calculate focal length at the same time: Pull four strings tight across the dish, so they are 45° apart and tape them in place with duct tape on the back edge of the dish. If the dish is true, then they should all meet at the center and just touch each other; if there are any gaps, then the dish is warped. The point where they meet is obviously just above the center of the dish, to help you aim your feedhorn.
Measure the exact diameter and the depth of the dish where the strings meet, then use this formula to calculate focal length:

http://www.satsig.net/focal-length-parabolic-dish.htm

Keep in mind that different feedhorns have different sweet spots - how far they want the focal point in the feedhorn.

I appreciate you posting this here and I'm going to try the "test" out. The only problem is that if the dish happens to be warped I'd have a nearly impossible time to find another one. I haven't seen another dish in the area for over 10 years. Keeping my fingers crossed that everything is even because in the back of my mind I'm fearful that it's warped.

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Captain_Kurtz

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Reply with quote  #44 
Good luck.
BTW, if it's warped it will probably show with just two strings - at a 90° angle.
Most people just use two strings - I go with four just to be sure. (My dish has four panels, so four strings.)
If you tie or tape the strings off at the ribs of the dish, then they will automatically be aligned as far as spacing.
With a sectional dish, you have some room to adjust the alignment between the panels to correct small errors in dish geometry.
If it's a one piece solid dish - and a one piece solid aluminum 8' dish would be awesome - maybe you could make adjustments or add shims to the mount to pull the dish back into its "true" shape? Only other thing I can think of would be to remove the dish, lay it face down on a flat surface (e.g., a garage floor) and put some weight on top. I would seek an expert - maybe someone at a welding or machine shop would know what to do?
iggy57

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Reply with quote  #45 
Seen this on another site this morning .

PBS Leaving C-Band on March 04 2019


Can not find any other info on it.
Could have something to do with this signal loss.


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