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area21

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Posts: 216
Reply with quote  #1 

I had successfully cross-compiled v4l-updatelee 4.20.0 for my Raspberry Pi 3,
I will list here the pros and cons of using it.

DVB Software  : Enigma2 - blindscan-s2 - blindscan plugin
DVB Hardware : Technisat Skystar USB HD

4097_0_1_0_0_0_0_0_0_0_20190914201313.jpg

4097_0_1_0_0_0_0_0_0_0_20190915211411.jpg 
Pros:
- SNR measurement is displayed properly.

screenshot_20190914201636.jpg 
- Blindscan works.

4097_0_1_0_0_0_0_0_0_0_20190914194849.jpg 
4097_0_1_0_0_0_0_0_0_0_20190914194630.jpg 
4097_0_1_0_0_0_0_0_0_0_20190914195004.jpg

Cons:
- Some Tps which works fine using the stock kernel doesn't work anymore after switching to v4l-updatelee 4.20.0.

For ex:
Frequency 10834V on Hot Bird 13E

screenshot_20190914201435.jpg 
Concl.:

Having blindscan feature is nice but if that will cause tune problems to some known working transponders then i prefer to use the stock kernel instead.

I can assure that it's not a hardware problem because if i simply switch back to the stock kernel the problem will be vanished.

I have no idea if it's due the modified stv090x by UDL or for whatever reason.

Fin:
I would like to have that problem sorted out (one day). [smile]


area21

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Posts: 216
Reply with quote  #2 
screenshot_20190915224239.jpg 
screenshot_20190915224300.jpg

Now back to the stock kernel,
Frequency 10834V works!!
Just to avoid anyone who will assume it's a hardware problem Okay? [smile]


area21

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Posts: 216
Reply with quote  #3 

Hi crazycat,
I noticed that neither the stock kernel nor UDL's kernel supports enigma2 SNR measurement in dB as you can see in post #1 (UDL) & post #2 (stock) screenshots.
Only your media_build on (PC) supports it nicely (see below screenshots).

db2.png 
db.png  

What i want to do is to alter the Raspberry Pi stock driver code in order to support that option then cross-compile it again.
Is it possible to do that?


majortom

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Posts: 5,793
Reply with quote  #4 
area21,
after having tuned something,  run the 'dvb-fe-tool' that is part of the v4l-utils package.
That will display the dvbv5 stats from a given device IF the stats are implemented to report the stats in dvbv5 api format for the given device.
If not, it will skip the metrics that are not in dvbv5 api format. ...If i recall in the mainline thus UDL also, I believe the stb61xxx tuner chip implements for strength dBm, but the stv09xx demod doesn't.
see snippet of one device (not avail in mainline) that I have implemented everything I could, for an ATSC tuner/demod. You will see how strength is dBm, cnr is dB, PostBer and PER is in x in 10^-x notation
https://pastebin.com/CqZK1L0m

meanwhile, from a different, more popular ATSC device (avail in mainline), notice that this doesn't support the PostBer and PER in dvbV5 format.
https://pastebin.com/dm0thbxY

I think the correct place for your issue is in the linux-media mailing list. Send them guys a note with some logs (not pretty pictures).
If they were to implement in mainline, sooner or later we'd be seeing that downstream, and would implement in UDL.
Ideally, if someone had the time, all dvb type devices that can, would have that implemented by now. But who has the time? Do you?


[pi3b ~]$ dvb-fe-tool --help
Usage: dvb-fe-tool [OPTION...]

A DVB frontend tool using API version 5

On the options below, the arguments are:
  ADAPTER      - the dvb adapter to control
  FRONTEND     - the dvb frontend to control
  SERVER       - server address which is running the dvb5-daemon
  PORT         - server port used by the dvb5-daemon

  -a, --adapter=ADAPTER      dvb adapter
  -A, --acoustical           beeps if signal quality is good. Also enables
                             femon mode. Please notice that console beep should
                             be enabled on your wm.
  -c, --count=COUNT          samples to take (default 0 = infinite)
  -d, --set-delsys=PARAMS    set delivery system
  -D, --device-mon           monitors device insert/removal
  -f, --frontend=FRONTEND    dvb frontend
  -g, --get                  get frontend
  -H, --server=SERVER        dvbv5-daemon host IP address
  -m, --femon                monitors frontend stats on an streaming frontend
  -T, --tcp-port=PORT        dvbv5-daemon host tcp port
  -v, --verbose              enables debug messages
  -?, --help                 Give this help list
      --usage                Give a short usage message
  -V, --version              Print program version

Mandatory or optional arguments to long options are also mandatory or optional
for any corresponding short options.

Report bugs to Mauro Carvalho Chehab <mchehab@kernel.org>.



__________________
Perfect 10 7.5' mesh Chapparal C/Ku Co-Rotor feed, Norsat 8115 CBAND, Norsat 4106A Ku Thomson Saginaw Actuator, Vbox positioner,
Home Brew Polarotor683 Servo circuit. Openbox S9, Prof7500, v4l-updatelee linux drivers installed.
DB8E/VHF Yagi rotor FM Bandstop ap-8700 preamp 8way split LG lcd.
ricardo's geo-orbit archive: https://web.archive.org/web/20071202191450/http://www.geo-orbit.org:80/sizepgs/tuningp2.html

area21

Registered:
Posts: 216
Reply with quote  #5 

Hi majortom.

Quote:
Originally Posted by majortom

If i recall in the mainline thus UDL also, I believe the stb61xxx tuner chip implements for strength dBm, but the stv09xx demod doesn't. 

So that feature has to be supported by the tuner and the demod?
I mean both of them.
Because i also tried crazycat media_build with an old TT 3200 that uses STB6100 tuner / STB0899 demod
I noticed that SNR is shown in dB as well.
That means that crazycat implemented that in all dvb devices used in his media_build?

Quote:
Originally Posted by majortom

I think the correct place for your issue is in the linux-media mailing list. Send them guys a note with some logs (not pretty pictures).

That's funny because when i tried to email them regarding the SNR measurement problem, my email was rejected by their spam filter because it contains pictures.
So, you are right, obviously they don't like pictures (regardless if they're pretty or not). [biggrin]
majortom

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Posts: 5,793
Reply with quote  #6 
No that is not exactly what I am saying. What I am saying is the dvbv5 api metric reporting needs to be done on a chip by chip basis. No one including crazycat is going to have access to every device out there to do such a task across the entire tree.
Typically the tuner provides the strength dBm, which doesn't mean much for satellite signals, but does for terrestrial broadcast. The demods typically report everything else (to the degree possible in said chip), if the developer included the dvbv5 api metrics in the driver they developed. If you look in the source code of any tuner or demod code, you will typically see an "author", and a list of "maintainers".
The list of Maintainers is gonna be a person monitoring the linux-media mailing list, to comment on any incoming patches, issues, so on.

eg - you can submit a patch to the linux-media mailing list, hopefully in their preferred format...
One of the maintainers will then review it and suggest changes, or a better way to do something.
You then re-submit with suggested changes, etc..
Once that goes thru the ringer a couple times, they'd approve it (if satisfied) and apply the patch(es) to their linux-media tree.
Eventually Linus would pull from linux-media, in to mainline. overly simplified, but that's the gist of it.

I have played around with STV0899, and while the DVB-S CNR seems accurate, never could figure out how to get the CNR to
make any sense whatsoever in DVB-S2 mode. I believe the stb0899 chip has two independent demods in it internally,
one for DVB-S, and another for DVB-S2. While primitive, it's actually a pretty complex device.


__________________
Perfect 10 7.5' mesh Chapparal C/Ku Co-Rotor feed, Norsat 8115 CBAND, Norsat 4106A Ku Thomson Saginaw Actuator, Vbox positioner,
Home Brew Polarotor683 Servo circuit. Openbox S9, Prof7500, v4l-updatelee linux drivers installed.
DB8E/VHF Yagi rotor FM Bandstop ap-8700 preamp 8way split LG lcd.
ricardo's geo-orbit archive: https://web.archive.org/web/20071202191450/http://www.geo-orbit.org:80/sizepgs/tuningp2.html

area21

Registered:
Posts: 216
Reply with quote  #7 

Perhaps crazycat had implemented it in popular tuner chipsets?
I dunno how the Maintainers will monitor linux-media mailing list if they have filters to reject every email!

Is that the correct email address?
//linux-media@vger.kernel.org

Here is their server reply by the way.

vger.kernel.org gave this error:
Remote server returned message detected as spam -> 550 5.7.1 Content-Policy reject msg: The message contains HTML subpart, therefore we consider it SPAM or Outlook Virus. TEXT/PLAIN is accepted.!

I wrote another TEXT/PLAIN email but it was also rejected then i gave up. [smile]

Regarding my old STB0899 device, i'm aware that some DVB-S2 Tps not locking properly using linux.
However that device works flawlessly on windows, it's a shame that Technotrend didn't release a linux driver for it when they produced it.

majortom

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Posts: 5,793
Reply with quote  #8 
I think in the past when I had sent email to linux-media mailing list, I had configured 'mutt', for my gmail account and then used mutt as the email client.
there is probably a howto somewhere on configuring email clients.

__________________
Perfect 10 7.5' mesh Chapparal C/Ku Co-Rotor feed, Norsat 8115 CBAND, Norsat 4106A Ku Thomson Saginaw Actuator, Vbox positioner,
Home Brew Polarotor683 Servo circuit. Openbox S9, Prof7500, v4l-updatelee linux drivers installed.
DB8E/VHF Yagi rotor FM Bandstop ap-8700 preamp 8way split LG lcd.
ricardo's geo-orbit archive: https://web.archive.org/web/20071202191450/http://www.geo-orbit.org:80/sizepgs/tuningp2.html

majortom

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Posts: 5,793
Reply with quote  #9 
btw, I was comparing stv090x in mainline vs stv090x in udl.
Udl is definitely supplying dvbv5 api stats in the module and mainline is not.
however in -udl, I think it may not be signaling to userspace upon init that it is going to
use dvbv5 api for stats/metrics, and for which ones. So an app designed for the dvbv5 api like dvb-fe-tool
doesn't know it...

Not totally sure, but when I have some time I'll try and play around with it, see if we can make that work with other apps
besides updateDVB. I am kinda anal about the stats myself, so I know where ur comin from.



__________________
Perfect 10 7.5' mesh Chapparal C/Ku Co-Rotor feed, Norsat 8115 CBAND, Norsat 4106A Ku Thomson Saginaw Actuator, Vbox positioner,
Home Brew Polarotor683 Servo circuit. Openbox S9, Prof7500, v4l-updatelee linux drivers installed.
DB8E/VHF Yagi rotor FM Bandstop ap-8700 preamp 8way split LG lcd.
ricardo's geo-orbit archive: https://web.archive.org/web/20071202191450/http://www.geo-orbit.org:80/sizepgs/tuningp2.html

area21

Registered:
Posts: 216
Reply with quote  #10 
quicksignal.png

I found a workaround for that issue without touching the driver code by using the plugin in the above screenshot.
The plugin's author uses a modified FrontendInfo.py which is slightly different from the original file used in Enigma2.

I assume it's the same method you used in modifying updateDVB except he used python while UDL used Qt.

It would be nice if you can figure out how to make it work natively without using any plugins same as crazycat media_build. [smile]

Edit: i think it's not that accurate as i compared it with crazycat screenshot.

-  crazycat media_build SNR: 68% = 13.6 dB
-  QuickSignal plugin     SNR: 75% = 12 dB [rolleyes]

 

 

 

 


crazycat

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Posts: 1,243
Reply with quote  #11 
Quote:
Originally Posted by crazycat
I noticed that neither the stock kernel nor UDL's kernel supports enigma2 SNR measurement in dB as you can see in post #1 (UDL) & post #2 (stock) screenshots.

Only your media_build on (PC) supports it nicely (see below screenshots).



I need review current OpenPli Enigma2 sources, but some time ago (2014/15) only "reverse calculation" RFLevel/SNR (dBm/dB) used in open-source Enigma2 (OpenPLi and forks like OpenAlliance). "Reverse calculation" from legacy DVBv3-API RFStrength/SNR (some 16-bit value, usual "normalized" value in %). My mods for stv090x and some other frontend drivers report RFStrength(%) = RFLevel(dBm) + 100 and SNR(%) = SNR(dB) * 5. +extended DVBv5-API signal statistic implemented in drivers, same in UDL media drivers.


__________________
Strong offset dish 0.95m on Powertech DG240 motor + ALPS BSTE8-751B Ku-Universal LNB. Variant CA-902 0.95 offset dish with 3xDreamSat DS-8 Ku-Universal LNBs (13E+4.8E+4W) + Variant CA-600 Ku-Circular LNB 36E + DiseqC 1.0. STB: GI8120 Lite. PC DVB: Omicom S2 PCI; TBS 6983 PCI; TBS QBox-CI USB(5980), 5927.
area21

Registered:
Posts: 216
Reply with quote  #12 
Quote:
Originally Posted by crazycat

 My mods for stv090x and some other frontend drivers report RFStrength(%) = RFLevel(dBm) + 100 and SNR(%) = SNR(dB) * 5. +extended DVBv5-API signal statistic implemented in drivers, same in UDL media drivers.


Hi crazycat,
That's interesting, so if your mods are the same in UDL media drivers then why dvb-fe-tool shows Signal in dBm & C/N in dB if i used your driver as follows:

Lock (0x1f) Signal= -41,00dBm C/N= 13,50dB postBER= 0
Layer A: Signal= 59,06% C/N= 67,57%
Lock (0x1f) Signal= -41,00dBm C/N= 13,50dB postBER= 0
Layer A: Signal= 59,06% C/N= 67,57%
Lock (0x1f) Signal= -41,00dBm C/N= 13,60dB postBER= 0
Layer A: Signal= 59,06% C/N= 68,07%
Lock (0x1f) Signal= -41,00dBm C/N= 13,50dB postBER= 0


However, if i used UDL's driver dvb-fe-tool shows Signal & C/N as a percentage values as follows:

Lock (0x1f) Signal= 66,07% C/N= 76,90% UCB= 50398 postBER= 0
Lock (0x1f) Signal= 66,00% C/N= 76,73% UCB= 50286 postBER= 0
Lock (0x1f) Signal= 66,08% C/N= 76,90% UCB= 50398 postBER= 0
Lock (0x1f) Signal= 66,05% C/N= 76,86% UCB= 50368 postBER= 0

I think that issue isn't related to enigma2 as that Signal Finder plugin should show SNR in dB out of the box because my tuner supports it.

Any idea? [rolleyes]

Quote:
Originally Posted by majortom
btw, I was comparing stv090x in mainline vs stv090x in udl. 
Udl is definitely supplying dvbv5 api stats in the module and mainline is not.
however in -udl, I think it may not be signaling to userspace upon init that it is going to
use dvbv5 api for stats/metrics, and for which ones. So an app designed for the dvbv5 api like dvb-fe-tool
doesn't know it...



majortom, i think you figured it out right, i'm sure if you got time to play around with it you can sort it out. [smile]


crazycat

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Reply with quote  #13 
Quote:
Originally Posted by area21
However, if i used UDL's driver dvb-fe-tool shows Signal & C/N as a percentage values as follows:
Lock (0x1f) Signal= 66,07% C/N= 76,90% UCB= 50398 postBER= 0 Lock (0x1f) Signal= 66,00% C/N= 76,73% UCB= 50286 postBER= 0 Lock (0x1f) Signal= 66,08% C/N= 76,90% UCB= 50398 postBER= 0 Lock (0x1f) Signal= 66,05% C/N= 76,86% UCB= 50368 postBER= 0



Strange, look like original V4L DVB drivers.

__________________
Strong offset dish 0.95m on Powertech DG240 motor + ALPS BSTE8-751B Ku-Universal LNB. Variant CA-902 0.95 offset dish with 3xDreamSat DS-8 Ku-Universal LNBs (13E+4.8E+4W) + Variant CA-600 Ku-Circular LNB 36E + DiseqC 1.0. STB: GI8120 Lite. PC DVB: Omicom S2 PCI; TBS 6983 PCI; TBS QBox-CI USB(5980), 5927.
majortom

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Reply with quote  #14 
area21, That looks to me like there is definitely a bug there in that device,
As I said, the dvbv5 api metrics need to be done in every chip known to man individually, in order to be done right. That said, I think LayerA, LayerB, etc is only relevant to isdbt type demods, so that looks like a bug to me.
Read the linux kernel documentation and tell me if you see any reference to LAYER A in anything other than isdbt type demods. Isdbt only used in South America Terrestrial far as I know.
https://www.kernel.org/doc/html/latest/media/uapi/dvb/fe_property_parameters.html?highlight=layer
Lock(0x1f)Signal=-41,00dBm C/N=13,50dB postBER=0
Layer A:Signal=59,06% C/N=67,57%

Below is from my prof7500 (stv090x)

~$ dvb-fe-tool -mg
FREQUENCY = 4293657878
INVERSION = OFF
SYMBOL_RATE = 30001576
INNER_FEC = 5/6
MODULATION = PSK/8
PILOT = OFF
ROLLOFF = 20
POLARIZATION = OFF
STREAM_ID = 4294967295
DELIVERY_SYSTEM = DVBS2
Lock   (0x1f) Signal= -34.45dBm C/N= 10.70dB
Lock   (0x1f) Signal= -34.47dBm C/N= 10.60dB

While below is from my stb0899 based device, which doesn't even function in the mainline linux kernel, so I can't compare, but wouldn't expect any development to occur there as it was probably designed over 20 years ago. But notice it prints that Layer A nonsense like yours.

~]$ dvb-fe-tool -mg -a 1
FREQUENCY = 1395123
INVERSION = OFF
SYMBOL_RATE = 20000000
INNER_FEC = 3/4
POLARIZATION = OFF
DELIVERY_SYSTEM = DVBS
Lock   (0x1f) Signal= -50.00dBm C/N= 12.70dB
    Layer A: Signal= 50.05% C/N= 63.56%
Lock   (0x1f) Signal= -50.00dBm C/N= 12.60dB
    Layer A: Signal= 50.05% C/N= 63.06%

__________________
Perfect 10 7.5' mesh Chapparal C/Ku Co-Rotor feed, Norsat 8115 CBAND, Norsat 4106A Ku Thomson Saginaw Actuator, Vbox positioner,
Home Brew Polarotor683 Servo circuit. Openbox S9, Prof7500, v4l-updatelee linux drivers installed.
DB8E/VHF Yagi rotor FM Bandstop ap-8700 preamp 8way split LG lcd.
ricardo's geo-orbit archive: https://web.archive.org/web/20071202191450/http://www.geo-orbit.org:80/sizepgs/tuningp2.html

area21

Registered:
Posts: 216
Reply with quote  #15 
Quote:
Originally Posted by crazycat


Strange, look like original V4L DVB drivers.


Exactly, that's why i said neither the stock kernel nor UDL's kernel supports enigma2 SNR measurement in dB.
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