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mips

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Reply with quote  #61 
Quote:
Originally Posted by andyinyakima
I am starting to think much of the corrupted streams might be from the ACM/VCM switching.
Also if you concentrated on the 16apsk transponders you are more prone to error prone BBFrames, because your gain has to be higher.


If that is true, then the task of recording an error-free recording could be a challenge. You might need enough gain to reliably handle any ACM switching to 32APSK. Someone with a large dish would have a better chance of pulling it off.

Quote:
Originally Posted by andyinyakima

mips can you tell what type of file it would be if I can get a longer trailer after the e3 55 00 05 83.
Or do you believe it is still error prone? Have you been able to assemble any PDUs? partial?

As you mentioned, the DFL is $1AC8 (857 in decimal), so each BB frame is 867 bytes in size. Taking the first line at offset 27965526, the next BB frame would be expected at (27965526+867) = 27966393, but you show the next entry is at offset 27966768, which doesn't match. Since the SYNC values are also discontinuous (goes from $9C to $9F), I'd say that stream is corrupted.

I haven't tried assembling any PDUs yet. Trying to figure out the format is challenging enough as is that I don't want to waste my time working with a recording that I know to be corrupted. I could scavenge small chunks of error-free data from some of midwestmac's recordings but haven't looked into that yet. Still hoping to get a long error-free recording in order to continue with the next step (GSE parsing).
wejones

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Reply with quote  #62 
Has anyone here found a transponder with these BBF/GSE things that is CCM instead of ACM/VCM.

Similar to andyinyakima, I don't think that we'll be able to obtain uncorrupted recordings from ACM/VCM transmissions.   From what I've seen, the TBS 6925 isn't quite capable of doing VCM, and I don't understand how any receiver can do ACM, since I think that involves communication between sender and receiver stations (I may be wrong on that).  
   But I've seen very few ACM/VCM signals that don't give continuity errors, and I suspect that those that don't have errors just aren't switching modes while being monitored.  I came to this conclusion a while back when a fellow weather enthusiast asked a question about using the 6925 for reception of the NOAAPORT transponder on SES1, which is VCM.   I had monitored that transponder many times, and was monitoring text products by pulling up recordings of individual PIDs into notepad.  So I told him that he should be able to do this with the 6925 instead of the more expensive commercial receivers recommended by NOAA.  However I was told that when the 6925 was used with the actual NOAA software with the 6925, that it reported numerous continuity errors, and gave corrupted data,  but didn't give continuity errors when used with the recommended receiver. 
    I thought this was strange, because I didn't remember seeing continuity errors on that transponder, but when I looked at it again, sure enough it was giving continuity errors.  Also, watching the TSREADER continuity counter, the errors came in bursts, which seemed likely to correspond to mode changes, but I wasn't positive.  This had me very suspicious about whether the current 6925 drivers were capable of actually doing ACM/VCM, however I thought that there was still a possibility that it might be due to the way NOAA was using VCM.   Ie, from what I've read, they are only switching between QPSK and 8PSK, and the QPSK transmission doesn't contain any data.  Ie it seems like they aren't using it for variable transmission conditions, but using it for sending different products in the different modes, and the product that was supposed to be in the QPSK mode was obsolete, so they were constantly sending just one bit.  Ie the constellation pattern looked like weak 8PSK superimposed on a single 1:30 bit of QPSK.  So it's possible that the 6925 is being confused by the non-existant info from the QPSK component, however that doesn't explain why the commercial receiver doesn't get confused. 
   Anyway I've been fairly convinced that the 6925 drivers aren't capable of doing ACM/VCM. 
So if there are any of these BBF/GSE things that aren't ACM/VCM, it might be a better candidate for getting error free recordings. 


midwestmac

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Reply with quote  #63 
What would be on the NOAAPORT transponder if one had the right equipment? Is it like teletext type weather reports mixed in with some jpeg images.
Just wondering I tried to record it once with no luck.

Also I was looking through the 16apsk/32apsk thread and there's that signal at SES2 3860 V 20841 which was CCM, Continuous, Single Input Stream. Looking at the posts it had a 70 mbit/s
Just an idea I guess its still there? I can't check it right now and don't think I could lock it good enough to record it.


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midwestmac

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Reply with quote  #64 
I'm wondering if this card can do acm/vcm too on the fly but, I might of finally got a couple of recording of this ACM transponder thats switching. It took a couple of tries.
200 mb and a 300 mb recording the whole file is clean up until the last few seconds  of recording. There's No CRC0,TS,GS-P,GS-HE or SIS present until the very end of the recording ironically on both for what ever reason. I'm Using the TBSrecorder. If I was to strip that away with the hex editor it would be perfect I think?

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wejones

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Reply with quote  #65 
Quote:
Originally Posted by midwestmac
What would be on the NOAAPORT transponder if one had the right equipment? Is it like teletext type weather reports mixed in with some jpeg images.
Just wondering I tried to record it once with no luck.
......


I can't remember exactly what's on it, but yes, it a mixture of a whole bunch of things, both text products, (which is coded in a hard to understand way. Sometimes I can figure out what it's saying, but other times I can't.)  I think there were 5 channels, something like a 101, 102, 103, 104, 105 .   It seemed like most of the text was on one of the 4 channels, but I can't remember which.  They aren't always sending data out of all 5 channels, so it's a bit of a guess.  I think the graphics included satellite imagery from the goes sats.  I never did figure out how to capture the graphics, so I don't really know what is there. Re the text, I haven't figured that out either.  I have seen some that looks like METAR format ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/METAR ), but it seems somewhat different, and I couldn't even identify the station identifiers.  Other times, it seems to be other data, reported from different stations around the country.   But I haven't made much progress at understanding how and when to find it.   You can get more info from the NOAAPORT web page ( http://www.nws.noaa.gov/noaaport/html/noaaport.shtml ).  They also have info about the programs that will download all the data, including the images. One is from Unisys, and one from Unidata.  They are both Unix/Linux programs, which really would be best to use on a dedicated computer due to the large amount of data it would be receiving. 
   On two different occasions, I tried to install these programs on first the Unisys on a RedHat linux, and then the Unidata on a Ubunto installation.  I never got anywhere with the old RedHat, but I was able to compile the first half of the Unidata program on the Ubuntu computer, however when I went to run it, it told me that the domain on my LAN wasn't set up properly.  My LAN isn't set up as a domain, it's set up as workgroups.  I tried everything, but it just refused to run until I fixed the LAN, so I gave up.
   I've always wanted to get that program to run, because I enjoy keeping track of weather.   I used to download GOES images from the old GOES TAP signal on one of the eastern satellites.  It was an FM^2 signal carrying APT style weather fax and images.  But that signal went dead probably a dozen or more years ago. 
    Anyway, sorry I couldn't help more.  About all I do is record from the 5 channels and search through the recordings with notepad, hoping to find something that's in text.  I wonder if IPCLEANER might pull out some of the images????
mips

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Reply with quote  #66 
Quote:
Originally Posted by wejones

   Anyway I've been fairly convinced that the 6925 drivers aren't capable of doing ACM/VCM. 
So if there are any of these BBF/GSE things that aren't ACM/VCM, it might be a better candidate for getting error free recordings. 

We'll have to eventually test all the modes anyway, so CCM is as good a start as any. Anything with A/V would be great so that we can see how it plays after extraction, but I'll settle for anything at this point.
mips

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Reply with quote  #67 
Quote:
Originally Posted by midwestmac

200 mb and a 300 mb recording the whole file is clean up until the last few seconds  of recording. There's No CRC0,TS,GS-P,GS-HE or SIS present until the very end of the recording ironically on both for what ever reason. I'm Using the TBSrecorder. If I was to strip that away with the hex editor it would be perfect I think?

That's great news. Those recordings are the best candidates so far. Please upload them when you get a chance. Thanks!
mips

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Reply with quote  #68 
Quote:
Originally Posted by wejones
I wonder if IPCLEANER might pull out some of the images????

NOAAPORT is not one of the supported IP formats, but for some reason, it sounds familiar. I recall seeing some PIDs with weather data, just not sure if it was NOAAPORT. I would have liked to clean them up if possible, but I didn't have any way to validate if the IPCleaner output was correct, so I put those aside and focused on TPs with A/V instead. However, with more info about the expected weather data format, I might be able to extract it.

midwestmac

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Reply with quote  #69 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mips

That's great news. Those recordings are the best candidates so far. Please upload them when you get a chance. Thanks!


Sorry I had a big emergency outside but I'm uploading to mediafire now. It can be slow sometimes though, almost like watching paint dry.
Thanks


Added: Ok I sent them I hope they work I didn't edit them you'll see at the end of them what I was wanting to strip away, and they still have that Dummy Frame? I guess.
DFL=80 SYNC=00 with the CRC $F7 in a few places

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mips

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Reply with quote  #70 
Quote:
Originally Posted by midwestmac

Sorry I had a big emergency outside but I'm uploading to mediafire now. It can be slow sometimes though, almost like watching paint dry.
Thanks

Added: Ok I sent them I hope they work I didn't edit them you'll see at the end of them what I was wanting to strip away, and they still have that Dummy Frame? I guess.
DFL=80 SYNC=00 with the CRC $F7 in a few places


No need to apologize, there is no rush. Hope everything's ok.

Thanks for the files. I'll make sure to strip out the end.

midwestmac

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Reply with quote  #71 

Every thing is good thanks Mips.

If anyone wants to try and record with TBSrecorder or StreamreaderDemo.
With there Tbs 6925 or 5925.

I found another good one to record, again its MIS  [frown]  61W 11932 V 5624 (ACM, Generic Continuous Stream)
Still looking for a ACM Transport stream that doesn't send Tsreader into locking up (when Looking at the pids with Ip/DVB mode) to see whats there.
I'm looking for TCP and "UDP" within the stream with Tsreader

61W 11847 V 5000 ACM Transport MIS might be a good one but, I can't lock it good enough to record @ 16 DB's


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photoman76

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Reply with quote  #72 
Quote:
Originally Posted by midwestmac

Still looking for a ACM Transport stream that doesn't send Tsreader into locking up (when Looking at the pids with Ip/DVB mode) to see whats there.

I'm looking for TCP and "UDP" within the stream with Tsreader



These might be what you are looking for:

Intelsat 23  53W

11766 H 6555

11989 H 19250

I have errors in TSReader on both of them, only 10 dB here.

Intelsat 23 is my Easternmost satellite and I'm looking through trees.



midwestmac

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Reply with quote  #73 
Thanks  Photoman! I'm in the neighborhood down there. I can get to 53 W. Its my eastern most too. Were I planted my dish I'm looking down my fence line through 2 trees over the neighbors roof. I found those but I got to tune this thing in just a hair.
Thanks. 

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andyinyakima

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Reply with quote  #74 
I'm of the opinion that Linux and probably even Windows DVB frontends, demuxes were not built with GSE in mind. I believe an edit is in order for Linux and while they are at it they should allow for extra professional features (spectrum scan, IQ plot, DVB-S2 extensions, etc). Does a rewrite sound too scary.

I also believe in my case that stv090x.c may have to be edited to compensate for GSE, mostly to handle the BB frames both normal and shorts (DVB-S2 extensions have three sizes).  I am of the belief that GSE has to be handled off to buffers right after demodulation or some of the info will be lost. Do all STV0900 and STV0903 handle short FEC FRAMES?

Do other people see this or am I missing the boat and falling in the water.[smile] Could be; there is an ocean of literature, software and protocols out there.

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andyinyakima
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Recs: TBS6983, TBS5925 __ Ant: 90cm on SG6100__OSes: Linux with v4l-updatelee drivers __ RPi2 with v4l-updatelee drivers

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midwestmac

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Reply with quote  #75 
Hey Andy, I took a break from this for a while. In linux is there a way to use to turn off the pid filtering or parsing? 

I have used the TBS recorder and sometimes I get errors or it locks up the pcie card and I have to reboot
Trial and error here alot!!
I did get a better recording of a GS-MIS-ACM signal, I think?? It runs through Mip's tool with no errors. At least I or we can see whats what. 
Here's a small piece of it.
42 00 00 00 2A E8 E6 00 00 E1 C5 59 00 02 00 FF
FD C1 00 00 00 01 59 45 00 05 4c 00 00 40 00
07 11 6C CB 0A 0A F3 03 EF C0 15 08 BA 14 CF
10 05 38 74 81 8021 F7 63 00 00 00 00 E9 FC
70 69 47 08 00 91 0A 18 CB 2A D1 B7 4F 

Of course in red is the GSE header then in purple the GSE 6 byte label. The rest I think is an extension header up to the 
47 08 00 in brown. The 47 08 00 is pid (2048)0x800 and the start of a ts.

With a hexeditor I can find the 6 byte label several times. I have tried to manually piece one together but it takes forever.
and I have to pay attention if there is a crc32 at the end of a GSE frame along with alot other stuff.
I'll send you a copy if you want it.



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Azbox Ultra, Pansat 2500, Prof7301,Tbs 6925,5980, Genpix 8psk card, Dektec 2137c, Hauppauge 950q
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