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skywalker7

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Posts: 87
Reply with quote  #1 

TO ALL,  BEWARE AND READ THIS THREAD BEFORE DOING BUSINESS WITH GLENTECH / TVROPRO!  YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED!

Doing Business as GlenTech and now change the name to C Band Forever!


the nightmare began when I sent my 4DTV receiver in to get a new battery & the most expensive maps..I was told I needed to send a Postal Money order because Paypal was to slow and they needed the money before starting..6 weeks later I was still waiting..in the 9th week I got the receiver back but NO MAPS..nothing!!!Sent unit back..they said the repair was $90 so I sent a Postal Money order as directed by Glen...it got there last Thursday (or before)..when I inquired about when they would ship the unit they said that the Money Order was deposited in the bank but would take 3 to 5 days to clear...this is when I blew up.."Money Orders are the same as cash"..that was like talking to a brick wall...it is 1 week since they got the money order but I have heard NOTHING...this whole MESS has been going on for just over 3 months...I do NOT recommend them...wish I had never sent the receiver in...Talked (email) with Rick Caylor so he now knows what is happening...By-the-way..Rick is the very best...honest, intelligent and one of the few left in the business I would highly recommend!!!!!  I am now wondering if I will ever see the 4DTV receiver again...I have spent (with all shipping & costs) over $450.00 & have NOTHING to show for it....

RickCaylor

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Reply with quote  #2 

skywalker7,

 

Thank you for the kind words directed at me.

 

I will make contact with them to see if I can get any feed back and let you know.

 

Rick


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Keep your eyes on the Sky!

tvropro

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Posts: 40
Reply with quote  #3 
I got an e-mail from Rick regarding your complaint. Your receiver is scheduled to go out with this weeks shipment on Friday May 4th as you should have been informed by e-mail. We ship once a week. The IRD has been checked personally by me and is working 100%.

Please follow our installation instructions on our website when reinstalling your receiver. Here is the direct link to the instructions: http://www.themusicworkshopchicago.com/4dtv/install.doc

If you have any concerns please contact me personally by phone at the office. M-F 10AM to 6pm  CST.

Thank You.

trojanman

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Posts: 59
Reply with quote  #4 
Quote:
Originally Posted by skywalker7

the nightmare began when I sent my 4DTV receiver in to get a new battery & the most expensive maps..I was told I needed to send a Postal Money order because Paypal was to slow and they needed the money before starting..6 weeks later I was still waiting..in the 9th week I got the receiver back but NO MAPS..nothing!!!Sent unit back..they said the repair was $90 so I sent a Postal Money order as directed by Glen...it got there last Thursday (or before)..when I inquired about when they would ship the unit they said that the Money Order was deposited in the bank but would take 3 to 5 days to clear...this is when I blew up.."Money Orders are the same as cash"..that was like talking to a brick wall...it is 1 week since they got the money order but I have heard NOTHING...this whole MESS has been going on for just over 3 months...I do NOT recommend them...wish I had never sent the receiver in...Talked (email) with Rick Caylor so he now knows what is happening...By-the-way..Rick is the very best...honest, intelligent and one of the few left in the business I would highly recommend!!!!!  I am now wondering if I will ever see the 4DTV receiver again...I have spent (with all shipping & costs) over $450.00 & have NOTHING to show for it....



You Know it is funny you should mention this story.  I have been without my 4dtv since January 29th when I sent my in perfect condition 4dtv in to have the battery replaced and the MAPS.  I completely checked the receiver before sending it in board and all.  I am somewhat of a guru with electronics so I know what is good and bad.  Well, 5 weeks into the ordeal i finally get and email stating there is acid all over my board and they did their absolute best to save to the board but alas they werent able to.  He went on about how the acid had been on the board for what looked like a long time.  THERE WAS NO ACID ON THE BOARD WENT IT LEFT MY HOUSE.  Now if they had an accident and blew up a battery trying to change out the old battery I can understand, Accidents happen. But to lie to me and say the acid was there for along is just crazy wrong.  Well, I sent them another receiver and it has been over 2 months and still nothing.  Every week it is it will be another week. Oh, and they want to charge me money for checking out the board on the previous receiver that WAS fine when it left my house.  I am wondering if I will ever see my second receiver that I sent them.  Terrible service to say the least.  Heck, if I had a subscription to SRL I would have missed nearly half a years worth of subscription service. Unbelievable.
tvropro

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Posts: 40
Reply with quote  #5 
Both Mikes and Jeff's receivers have been sent out by me personally today, they have both been sent the tracking #'s , They will be receiving them  in a few days.
MikeC

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Posts: 86
Reply with quote  #6 
I had my 922 serviced by Glentech.  It took about two months for new maps and a battery change.  I phoned Glen twice during this period and found him both cooperative and informative.  The delay was caused by the amount of receivers in line ahead of mine.  When the 922 could not get a DC lock (a problem before I shipped it) he phoned me and then shipped it to ATS.

When the 922 was shipped back to me it was in perfect condition.  I can park it on birds and not worry about any downloads corrupting it.  The TDT count is 606.  Although the work is not inexpensive and did take a while to complete,  it was worth it for me.  When I recover from paying my property tax I will sent in a second 922.  My experience with Glentech was very satisfactory and I have no qualms about their work.
Skip

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Reply with quote  #7 

If I have five pizza pan units with basic package what are the advantages of having my 920 revived? Currently my 920 is used to view racing, PBS and space launches.


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bluzee

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Reply with quote  #8 
I don't understand how a scrambling system can change picture quality.  The picture quality of C Band digital  was better because they used less compression and crammed less channels into the transport stream than what the pizza dish companies where doing. 
virginiap20007

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Posts: 980
Reply with quote  #9 

Perhaps Tvpro should have left out the word "scrambling".  He is talking about the dc-2 system being a  transport method better than the ones used by Dish and Direct tv.   In the early days the " first generation signals"  were dc-2, beamed back down and then beamed back up and then back to the small dish subscribers.   It's like making copy of a copy of a copy.  It's never as good as the orginal.


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9ft.button hook mesh HtoH mount; 4dtv922 C/KU feed horn w/ slaved AZ prem, looped pan 9500, and a Manhattan at the end.. Got a philips suround sound in there and SONY BRAVIA TV
bluzee

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Reply with quote  #10 
That makes more sense.  DCII as a transport is kind of an antique now compared to the new systems, but you still get first generation compared to reprocessed and that is a big diff. How efficient the transport system is matters to the broadcaster. 

Definitely agree the quality of the old units beats the new stuff on the market. I keep my analog receiver around to turn my dish. It has a big honkin' external power supply for the motor.  Ultra reliable except for one minor lightning issue.  Well worth fixing up just for that.  I don't think the new dish movers will put out enough juice to turn my dish in the winter when it's minus 40. They are built to turn a little Ku motor not a C Band motor.
virginiap20007

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Posts: 980
Reply with quote  #11 

Well Bluzee;  I got the money now to send in my 922 to get it fixed: bat.bug fix, and ultra maps. I've got a 920 to put in it's place but it only has 21 sat tiles [did a factory re-set when I removed it]   I need to figure out which sats are important that I need to program in to the 920.  My wife would not be happy if I did not locate Anik f-2 as she watches her soaps feed there in the early morning hours.  Looks like the waiting period is  2 months or more so my scanning of the skys will be limited.  


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9ft.button hook mesh HtoH mount; 4dtv922 C/KU feed horn w/ slaved AZ prem, looped pan 9500, and a Manhattan at the end.. Got a philips suround sound in there and SONY BRAVIA TV
johbru

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Reply with quote  #12 
My gripe with Digicipher is the different modes which my 922 cannot receive.  I believe it is an MPEG-2.  Interestingly, somewhere around 12 to 15 to 1 compression is the peak of perceived PQ with MPEG-2.  I also found that ASCN could not authorize my receiver which was the reason I bought the 922 initially.  Perhaps when my current SLR subscription runs out I may avail myself of the update..
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bluzee

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Reply with quote  #13 
Quote:
Even with compression being 12 to 1 on H2H the picture quality is still much higher than the pizza systems at that same ratio.


That is because pizza systems are second generation.  The DCII digital signal uses lossy compression then they reprocess again with lossy compression  to put it up on their system.  It won't matter if the first generation is DCII or DVB-S2 it'll always look better than what the pizza dish offers up.

Quote:
Digicipher can achieve excellent picture quality even stretching the rubber band so to speak.


It's subject to the same laws of physics as the rest of the world.

DCII transport system had a slight advantage over DVB-S in the amount of data that could be transmitted over a transponder.  The compression codec was still the same. 

Quote:
OTA ATSC for broadcast TV is actually a  form of Digicipher


It actually really sncks that ATSC was chosen over DVB-T.  It would have been nice to finally get back in sync with the rest of the world.   ATSC over DVB-T is the reason no one can watch OTA on their new AzBox  receivers.  We always have to be odd ball and different over her in North America.  It creates extra problems for FTA people to overcome.
wejones

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Reply with quote  #14 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluzee
Quote:
Even with compression being 12 to 1 on H2H the picture quality is still much higher than the pizza systems at that same ratio.


That is because pizza systems are second generation.  The DCII digital signal uses lossy compression then they reprocess again with lossy compression  to put it up on their system.  It won't matter if the first generation is DCII or DVB-S2 it'll always look better than what the pizza dish offers up.

 Re this 1st, 2nd, 3rd generation thing, that may have been true back in the old days, but I really doubt that the 1st generation of most of the DBS signals is no longer even sent by satellite.  I don't have any 1st hand knowledge to support this, but based on the huge number of channels involved, it's got to be going by some other mode, be it fiber or internet or something like that, so I'm guessing that the 1st generation available to DBS is the same as that available to 4DTV services. .  The 1st generation can't possibly be DCII, except for a handful of channels.
     My opinion is that there is virtually no difference in the capabilities, and actually with 8PSK, the DBS services have the capability to put up twice the quality of a DCII service if they wanted to.  It's just that the DBS services choose to squeeze the maximum number of channels into the bandwidth knowing that the majority of their customers don't care.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bluzee

Quote:
Digicipher can achieve excellent picture quality even stretching the rubber band so to speak.


It's subject to the same laws of physics as the rest of the world.

DCII transport system had a slight advantage over DVB-S in the amount of data that could be transmitted over a transponder.  The compression codec was still the same. 

I would think that if we're talking 4DTV and standard DCII equipment, that the DVB-S would even have the advantage relative to the amount of data the could be transmitted over a transponder, since DCII is limited to 29270 SR QPSK, and even QPSK DVB-S can go up higher than that, such as the 32362 SRs used by CBS. And if you include 8PSK, you've got an even bigger advantage for DVB.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluzee

Quote:
OTA ATSC for broadcast TV is actually a  form of Digicipher


It actually really sncks that ATSC was chosen over DVB-T.  It would have been nice to finally get back in sync with the rest of the world.   ATSC over DVB-T is the reason no one can watch OTA on their new AzBox  receivers.  We always have to be odd ball and different over her in North America.  It creates extra problems for FTA people to overcome.

I agree.  I'm convinced that the ATSC was not adopted instead of DVB-T due to it being superior, but instead for political reasons, trying intentionally to not be in sync with the rest of the world to give north American companies a slight advantage.  Unfortunately, they needed more than a slight advantage.

But back to the question of why would one revive an old 4DTV, it's certainly not due to quality of the video, as most people would prefer to watch MPEG4 HD on DBS rather than SD on a 4DTV, and those who want the quality are going to wait for real high quality HD DVB-S2 feeds.   I think the main reason would be to give you the capability to see a few more FP or ZK channels that you can't receive with a DVB receiver, and gives you something to watch on a receiver now being used to just push the dish around.   Just my opinion.



bluzee

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Reply with quote  #15 
They had some really lame  ideas when they built these units. 

Death by battery...  death by channel maps...  these things don't stand much of a chance. 

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